Big time Embouchure issues

[ColinHerrington]

https://youtube.com/shorts/0j3cyAFT8oo? ... KkPwDzINxB

Hi everyone

I've been having some major playing issues over these past few months. My lips have been really tight, closed off, and worn out. I think it may be because I've been so loud in marching band this past semester. Texas high School marching band demands a lot of you

My embochure has been shaky, my low range closed off and hard to sustain, less flexibility, my high range tougher to get up to, and my overall playing has gotten tighter and more closed off. It's also been harder to take in as much air as usual, and my notes have been taking more air to sustain. Maybe that's just because I've been playing louder for orchestra, I'm not sure.

My lesson teacher and band director advised me to take 2 or 3 days off. I took 2 days off, and the problems have persisted. It's making it very frustrating to play and practice because I used to be able to play so much better than this. I don't know what the problem is either. Maybe I need more rest? But I have All-State and college auditions coming up in January and I need to practice for them. I don't know how to fix this.

Maybe I've just gotten way worse at playing for some reason, but I used to be able to play so open and I really enjoyed my sound.

YouTube link at the top of the post (I know I need to work on my tuning ). Hopefully somebody can help my playing get back on track. I would really appreciate it

[BGuttman]

I'd try some long tones. Work on going from loud to as soft as you can. Then go softer. Then crescendo back to loud. The longer you can go on one breath he better. Also, concentrate on beautiful open sound.

Does your lesson teacher play the trombone too? If not maybe find one who does.

If money isn't a problem, you could take a lesson or two with Dave Wilken or Doug Elliott over Skype. They are both embouchure experts who can really help.

[Doug Elliott]

With your face in the dark I can't see anything of what you're doing.
Basing your playing around low Bb is not doing you any favors.
You're playing too loud.
Both of those things are blowing your chops out. If the necessary playing you do is loud, you need to counteract that with very soft practice. And I bet you can't play soft at all.
The first things I would have you do are to start all of your warmup and practice on middle Bb (top of the staff) or higher, and do it softly. If you can't play soft, keep trying.
I do lessons by Skype if you want more advice on fixing it. It doesn't take long if you do things right.

[Wilktone]

I was also going to comment on not being able to see what I need to because you're backlit and that brings your face into shadow. If/when you catch a lesson with Doug you'll want to adjust your camera and lights.

The one things I do think I see is that you drop your jaw pretty far when you take a breath and then when you go to start the blowing you have to try to get everything in place all at once. You might be pinning your lips a bit too far open or twisting them around inside the mouthpiece while hitting that moving target. Try keeping your jaw still, maintain a little more mouthpiece pressure while breathing and keep your lips lightly touching together in the center. Breathe through the mouth corners instead.

Dave

[tbdana]

Hey Colin,

First, I see a ton of raw potential there. You have the ability to become a really good trombone player.

Second, I absolutely agree with Doug that you should (1) make the default focal point of your play higher in register, and (2) practice softly. In fact, you should make a game of playing as softly as you can, which won't be very soft at first, but will get better as you practice.

It's so easy to blow out your chops playing loud. From the tone you get, I can hear that you've done that. Certainly, good players can play very loud. But there's a difference between focused and correct loudness and the uncontrolled spread that you're getting. If you blow out your chops as you seem to have, there's no coming back from that until you do the work to repair the consequences of poor habits. I always remember the words of two great trombonists. Ralph Sauer once said, "You find out who can really play when the music gets soft." And Bill Watrous put it a little less delicately, saying, "Any damn fool can play loud. It's the real players that can play soft." That's so true! And doing so forces you to use good habits.

And until you've undone the consequences of improper playing, you should just refuse to play loudly. Whatever groups you play in, make it a point to play no louder than mezzo forte, no matter what the written dynamics are. You'll probably find that you get heard just as well at lower volume with a properly focused embouchure.

Doug Elliot is heralded by a great many players an expert at fixing this stuff. You should definitely invest in some Zoom/Skype lessons from him. Get yourself back on the right track without making further mistakes. You have the ability to become a real player, but you have to point your ship in the right direction to reach your destination. Otherwise, you'll just keep wandering at sea. (I love a good boat metaphor! LOL!)

[ColinHerrington]

Thank you so much for the tips everyone. I just got back from a trip so today's the first day I have time to seriously practice. I've started playing soft and centering my playing around top of the staff Bb and it's a struggle. My embouchure is quite shaky, but I don't feel crazy tired 5 minutes into my practice session like I used to. My lips are definitely tired after doing long tones and lip slurs, but I feel like I might be able to get back into shape if I keep doing this gentle, soft practicing. Thank you guys for showing me the importance of soft practicing and playing.

It's so weird. It feels like I've lost a lot of what I had in my playing, but it feels like it's still there, underneath all the shakiness and struggle. I guess that's what constantly pushing past your limits and blowing your face out in marching band will do to you.

Thanks for the tips guys. I really appreciate it.

[jthomas105]

What general location are you located in Texas?

Houston, Austin, San Antonio, Dallas, Ft. Worth, Mid-Cities, other???

I am on east side of Dallas and know several teachers in other parts of Texas that could be of help.

[baBposaune]

Stop playing long tones and lip slurs. Stop playing loud.

Blow air only with the lips close but apart enough for the air to pass between them. Blow until a note starts and sustain softly for two or three beats at quarter note equals 60. Any note that you can easily start with air will do. Repeat this a few more times then go down a half step and do the same. Take the horn off your lips after each note. Do this for six or seven half steps and do not increase the volume, try to stay in the mp range or softer if you can. Even if it sounds "bad" don't worry, it's not about tone at this point, it's about bringing the blown out chops back to functionality.

Good luck!

[tbdana]

Stop playing long tones and lip slurs.

[baBposaune]

I stand by my comment. Loud long tones and keeping the horn on the face is not going to help right now, at this moment. It's time for recovery and that requires a different discipline until the problems are remedied.

[ColinHerrington]

Stop playing long tones and lip slurs. Stop playing loud.

Blow air only with the lips close but apart enough for the air to pass between them. Blow until a note starts and sustain softly for two or three beats at quarter note equals 60. Any note that you can easily start with air will do. Repeat this a few more times then go down a half step and do the same. Take the horn off your lips after each note. Do this for six or seven half steps and do not increase the volume, try to stay in the mp range or softer if you can. Even if it sounds "bad" don't worry, it's not about tone at this point, it's about bringing the blown out chops back to functionality.

Good luck!

Thanks! This is along the lines of what I've been trying to do with soft long tones in my warmup. I'll give this a go as well. Thanks for the advice!

[ColinHerrington]

What general location are you located in Texas?

Houston, Austin, San Antonio, Dallas, Ft. Worth, Mid-Cities, other???

I am on east side of Dallas and know several teachers in other parts of Texas that could be of help.

I'm located north of Dallas, in the Denton area

[baBposaune]

Stop playing long tones and lip slurs. Stop playing loud.

Blow air only with the lips close but apart enough for the air to pass between them. Blow until a note starts and sustain softly for two or three beats at quarter note equals 60. Any note that you can easily start with air will do. Repeat this a few more times then go down a half step and do the same. Take the horn off your lips after each note. Do this for six or seven half steps and do not increase the volume, try to stay in the mp range or softer if you can. Even if it sounds "bad" don't worry, it's not about tone at this point, it's about bringing the blown out chops back to functionality.

Good luck!

Thanks! This is along the lines of what I've been trying to do with soft long tones in my warmup. I'll give this a go as well. Thanks for the advice!

For this to be a recovery exercise you should focus on a few things: keep it soft and I mean REALLY soft. Don't start the sound with the tongue, AIR ONLY. Let the sound start when it wants to. Keep the duration shorter than you normally would with "long tones." Do this for maybe 3 minutes then stop. Rest. Come back to it later. After things start to feel good, then try some of your normal routine while keeping the volume down and keeping the air moving.
It's tempting to jump back on the horse and attempt the fast fix but easy does it on rebuilding the chops, particularly when they are "blown out" or you are having a wavering sound or Heaven forbid, you have damaged the lips to some degree.

[ColinHerrington]

Thanks! This is along the lines of what I've been trying to do with soft long tones in my warmup. I'll give this a go as well. Thanks for the advice!

For this to be a recovery exercise you should focus on a few things: keep it soft and I mean REALLY soft. Don't start the sound with the tongue, AIR ONLY. Let the sound start when it wants to. Keep the duration shorter than you normally would with "long tones." Do this for maybe 3 minutes then stop. Rest. Come back to it later. After things start to feel good, then try some of your normal routine while keeping the volume down and keeping the air moving.
It's tempting to jump back on the horse and attempt the fast fix but easy does it on rebuilding the chops, particularly when they are "blown out" or you are having a wavering sound or Heaven forbid, you have damaged the lips to some degree.

Oh I see. Air starts. Very soft. Very easy on the chops. Okay, I think I can do that. I'll take your advice and try to wait a little bit before I jump back into my normal routine. It's hard because I have all state auditions coming up on the 11th of January, and then college auditions after that, but I'll need to make sure I actually have chops to play with for those auditions.

Thank you for the great advice, I'll definitely use it as I keep practicing.

[baBposaune]

For this to be a recovery exercise you should focus on a few things: keep it soft and I mean REALLY soft. Don't start the sound with the tongue, AIR ONLY. Let the sound start when it wants to. Keep the duration shorter than you normally would with "long tones." Do this for maybe 3 minutes then stop. Rest. Come back to it later. After things start to feel good, then try some of your normal routine while keeping the volume down and keeping the air moving.
It's tempting to jump back on the horse and attempt the fast fix but easy does it on rebuilding the chops, particularly when they are "blown out" or you are having a wavering sound or Heaven forbid, you have damaged the lips to some degree.

Oh I see. Air starts. Very soft. Very easy on the chops. Okay, I think I can do that. I'll take your advice and try to wait a little bit before I jump back into my normal routine. It's hard because I have all state auditions coming up on the 11th of January, and then college auditions after that, but I'll need to make sure I actually have chops to play with for those auditions.

Thank you for the great advice, I'll definitely use it as I keep practicing.

You should have enough time if your audition is on Jan. 11. If you do the recovery thing and not jump ahead to "normal" playing you could be on the road to your usual practice within 2-3 days. After that you will still need to make sure you don't play anything that is remotely like marching band.

I had a similar situation at the same time in my music career as you are having. If only I had gotten some good advice back then...

I had injured my lips after I passed my audition to the California All State Jazz band. The week of rehearsals with Leon Breeden of North Texas State was brutal because nothing felt right. My lower lip was in pain. But I muddled through but didn't like what I heard. Also, I kept practicing over the summer and my college audition didn't go as well as it could have because I was not fully recovered. Eventually my teacher got me back on track but it seemed like an eternity until I was back to 100%.

[ColinHerrington]

Oh I see. Air starts. Very soft. Very easy on the chops. Okay, I think I can do that. I'll take your advice and try to wait a little bit before I jump back into my normal routine. It's hard because I have all state auditions coming up on the 11th of January, and then college auditions after that, but I'll need to make sure I actually have chops to play with for those auditions.

Thank you for the great advice, I'll definitely use it as I keep practicing.

You should have enough time if your audition is on Jan. 11. If you do the recovery thing and not jump ahead to "normal" playing you could be on the road to your usual practice within 2-3 days. After that you will still need to make sure you don't play anything that is remotely like marching band.

I had a similar situation at the same time in my music career as you are having. If only I had gotten some good advice back then...

I had injured my lips after I passed my audition to the California All State Jazz band. The week of rehearsals with Leon Breeden of North Texas State was brutal because nothing felt right. My lower lip was in pain. But I muddled through but didn't like what I heard. Also, I kept practicing over the summer and my college audition didn't go as well as it could have because I was not fully recovered. Eventually my teacher got me back on track but it seemed like an eternity until I was back to 100%.

Wow that sounds like a tough situation. That's inspiring that you've been through something similar and made it out the other side. Thanks for telling me your story. I'll do the recovery routine you suggested and hopefully I'm feeling better soon. Thanks a lot!

[Doug Elliott]

Your "normal routine" is part of what got you in trouble.
Don't go back to it.

[baBposaune]

Colin: any updates on your progress so far?